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27GV
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5249 Posts
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Posted - 13 Feb 2015 :  22:26:39  Show Profile Send 27GV a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by bundy5

quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

quote:
Originally posted by REM

quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

The country is broke and it's going to get worse.
It's about time folk from all political persuasions realised and admitted that, then set about trying to limit the borrowing and pay back the debt.



If this is done fairly.....people will support budget and fiscal reform....for example....never mind a medicare surcharge and the research fund tax....what about negative gearing? Even more so... whatabout the big end of town.....???



How about broadening/increasing the GST?



That doesn't fix the inherent problems in our economy - workplace reform, competition reform, small business changes etc - they are the real drivers.



The only workplace reform Abbott has done is help remove workplaces. 12 year unemployment high.

How about actively going after corporate tax rorts?

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/hockey-backflips-on-tax-laws-to-target-multinational-profit-shifters-20141216-128ebg.html

Wait, it's another Lib backflip.

Worst government in Aussie history.


_Mford
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bundy5
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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  06:51:22  Show Profile Send bundy5 a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by 27GV

quote:
Originally posted by bundy5

quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

quote:
Originally posted by REM

quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

The country is broke and it's going to get worse.
It's about time folk from all political persuasions realised and admitted that, then set about trying to limit the borrowing and pay back the debt.



If this is done fairly.....people will support budget and fiscal reform....for example....never mind a medicare surcharge and the research fund tax....what about negative gearing? Even more so... whatabout the big end of town.....???



How about broadening/increasing the GST?



That doesn't fix the inherent problems in our economy - workplace reform, competition reform, small business changes etc - they are the real drivers.



The only workplace reform Abbott has done is help remove workplaces. 12 year unemployment high.

How about actively going after corporate tax rorts?

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/hockey-backflips-on-tax-laws-to-target-multinational-profit-shifters-20141216-128ebg.html

Wait, it's another Lib backflip.

Worst government in Aussie history.



So if Turnbull becomes leader will it still be the "worst government in Aussie history"? FFS - you labor supporters have no sense of perspective and have incredibly only a short-term memory.

To respond to Bruce in the NRL thread: it is probably the single hardest loss I have had to deal with at Souths to lose Bully. Much worse than Sam Burgess as he didn't symbolise Souths as Bully did. I think a lot will underestimate just how much a loss he will be to Souths but I fully understand how engrossed he is with NZ and I think given that he will make the successful transition that others haven't.
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CP
Safety Car Pilot



Australia
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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  07:07:55  Show Profile  Visit CP's Homepage Send CP a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by bundy5
I don't see any disasters there in terms of government incompetence. At least not compared to the Rudd/Gillard years.



You are either delusional or a fully paid up Liberal member. The former, I can't help you with, but the latter, I suggest you get a refund as it isn't money well spent.

Where do we start?

Free trade deals with our best buddies in Asia, which while it could be a good thing for farmers and miners, gives an already harder ****ing up the arse of whatever little manufacturing sector we have left.

Potential loosening of 457 Visas. Yes, I know someone will say that there are Aussies that don't want to work (it's only a minority that don't want to work though) and they are needed, whilst that is true (most of our best doctors come from Overseas), they are fine and fill that much needed void for skilled employment and that is fine. However, some of the lower skilled jobs offer and employ 457 Visa holders. Take hospitality as an example. A very competitive industry that young Australians aspire to get into, yet can't find employment as 475s are preferred. And Abbott wants to loosen the restrictions on that Visa for low skilled employment?

Class Warfare. Probably unintentional, but the Captain and his equally incompetent Vice Captain have started Class Warfare. First it was with the fact that poor people don't drive cars (yet had to look for 40 jobs a month) so a fuel tax won't affect them, the $7 medicare co payment was justified because a kid could be born today that lives to 150, and then claiming that felt entitled to pay more for healthcare when one of his family members had a broken arm. That's just Hokey Joe's incompetence. As for The Captain, while the knighting of Philip can be swept under the rug, his budget measures can't. While there cuts needed to bring the country back into the black, you can't justify your cuts to healthcare and education while pushing the barrow for paid parental leave. Yep, cut the things that lower socio-economic groups need yet ensure that rich, well to do mothers still get paid half their wage.

He doesn't have to be popular, he just has to be a good leader, and if the failed leadership spill proved anything, he can't even do that.
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Legendary Gerry
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Australia
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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  07:44:27  Show Profile Send Legendary Gerry a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by bundy5

quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

quote:
Originally posted by REM

quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

The country is broke and it's going to get worse.
It's about time folk from all political persuasions realised and admitted that, then set about trying to limit the borrowing and pay back the debt.



If this is done fairly.....people will support budget and fiscal reform....for example....never mind a medicare surcharge and the research fund tax....what about negative gearing? Even more so... whatabout the big end of town.....???



How about broadening/increasing the GST?



That doesn't fix the inherent problems in our economy - workplace reform, competition reform, small business changes etc - they are the real drivers.



It's pretty obvious that no single solution will fix the economy and our ever spiralling debt. I was more thinking as part of a fairer package.
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bigem
A polar bear



Australia
15994 Posts
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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  07:55:20  Show Profile Send bigem a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
3rd lowest deficit against GDP in the world, we are not broke.

We are slightly broken, but that is because we currently have the poorest performing government in our short history.

When a government fails to get any of its so recalled 'reforms' through the senate,ther are obviously problems with the content of those reforms!

Even a basket case Labor party was doing better government than the so-called grown ups have done so far!

6 days along from Tony's speech of 'good government' starts today, they have now sacked the government whip!

Phil Ruddock is one of the good guys, the backbenchers wont like this at all, Tony is listening that well, that he has removed the only guy who had the balls to take the backbenchers concerns to the cabinet members!

Another ****up by a goose without a clue!


Naphine, Newman, next Baird!

Congratulations to Stacia, the new accidental Premier of Queensland!!

Cant help but think that Abbotts government is that on the nose that the LNP will be banished into the back blocks in successive state elections!!


New Commodore Hey! So you used your own money? Would you like to buy a used bridge?

Edited by - bigem on 14 Feb 2015 08:01:20
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bundy5
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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  08:16:35  Show Profile Send bundy5 a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

quote:
Originally posted by bundy5

quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

quote:
Originally posted by REM

quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

The country is broke and it's going to get worse.
It's about time folk from all political persuasions realised and admitted that, then set about trying to limit the borrowing and pay back the debt.



If this is done fairly.....people will support budget and fiscal reform....for example....never mind a medicare surcharge and the research fund tax....what about negative gearing? Even more so... whatabout the big end of town.....???



How about broadening/increasing the GST?



That doesn't fix the inherent problems in our economy - workplace reform, competition reform, small business changes etc - they are the real drivers.



It's pretty obvious that no single solution will fix the economy and our ever spiralling debt. I was more thinking as part of a fairer package.



Long term we are still paying more tax than what we have to.

To respond to Bruce in the NRL thread: it is probably the single hardest loss I have had to deal with at Souths to lose Bully. Much worse than Sam Burgess as he didn't symbolise Souths as Bully did. I think a lot will underestimate just how much a loss he will be to Souths but I fully understand how engrossed he is with NZ and I think given that he will make the successful transition that others haven't.
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Legendary Gerry
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Australia
22231 Posts
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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  10:01:27  Show Profile Send Legendary Gerry a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
If you're paying more tax than you have to then that's entirely your fault.

By changing the GST and scrapping some of the other taxes, isn't that a fairer way of getting income for the government?
If you only spend a little you only pay a little; if you spend a lot you pay a lot! Much fairer (as REM is on about) in my book.
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REM
Team Manager



Australia
14227 Posts
joined 27 Sep 03

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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  10:05:51  Show Profile Send REM a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by bigem

3rd lowest deficit against GDP in the world, we are not broke.

We are slightly broken, but that is because we currently have the poorest performing government in our short history.

When a government fails to get any of its so recalled 'reforms' through the senate,ther are obviously problems with the content of those reforms!

Even a basket case Labor party was doing better government than the so-called grown ups have done so far!

6 days along from Tony's speech of 'good government' starts today, they have now sacked the government whip!

Phil Ruddock is one of the good guys, the backbenchers wont like this at all, Tony is listening that well, that he has removed the only guy who had the balls to take the backbenchers concerns to the cabinet members!

Another ****up by a goose without a clue!


Naphine, Newman, next Baird!

Congratulations to Stacia, the new accidental Premier of Queensland!!

Cant help but think that Abbotts government is that on the nose that the LNP will be banished into the back blocks in successive state elections!!





I bet we don't hear this again anytime soon....."I'm Mike Baird, the privatisation premier!"

That's great, it starts with an earthquake
Birds and snakes, and aeroplanes
And Lenny Bruce is not afraid!
"Remember that in the end nobody wins, unless everybody wins!" Springsteen BTR.


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Zac
Lumberjack



Australia
9780 Posts
joined 24 Dec 04

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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  11:17:17  Show Profile Send Zac a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by bigem

3rd lowest deficit against GDP in the world, we are not broke.

We are slightly broken, but that is because we currently have the poorest performing government in our short history.
3rd lowest deficit against GDP in the world? Don't think so. Our government debt to GDP is 28.6% as of December 2014 - and it has plummeted since 2007. (Hi, Trev. Cue "GFC" now.) That is, our government debt is 28.6% of our yearly gross domestic product, and that is all the money earned by everything we produce and sell, including everything we dig out of the ground - iron ore, coal, bauxite, uranium, etc. If we don't include those, and only what we actually make, we'd be getting close to last. Our total debt (government and private) is way, way more. If 28.6% places us 3rd, then here's a few more: Bangladesh 18%, Chile 12.8%, China 22.4%, Cuba 21.10%, Estonia 10%, Haiti 21.32%, Indonesia 26.11%, Iran 10.63%, Kuwait 5.28%, Libya 6.8%, Nigeria 11% (those scams must be performing well), Peru 19.6%, Saudi Arabia 2.68%, and so on. There's another 34 countries that I counted, placing us 47th, which is down a bit from 3rd.

That's not the point, though. We can always find some comparison to convince ourselves that we're actually not doing too badly. Forgetting about all those comparisons with other countries and just comparing ourselves to ourselves, we've gone from keeping our national budget reasonably balanced, to increasing spending by borrowing and borrowing, to now borrowing and borrowing just to make the interest payments on our borrowings. There may be some way we can keep up that borrowing to repay our borrowings without doing anything to claw back some debt, while continuing to keep spending at our current rate, (or increasing spending as Labor seems to think is the way to go), but I haven't seen how that can be done yet.

We mightn't have a "budget crisis" yet, just as the current government hasn't had any actual "disasters" yet, but whether we have or not just depends on our use of the English language.

EDIT: Oops! nearly forgot to include the link http://www.tradingeconomics.com/australia/government-debt-to-gdp Scroll down to 'COUNTRIES', and click the drop down box to 'WORLD'. I just checked again. Yep, we're 47th. We're almost level pegging with Bosnia Herzegovina, Senegal, Rwanda and Cambodia - but they don't have the stuff to dig out of the ground that we have. Maybe em was looking at the 2006 list.

Edited by - Zac on 14 Feb 2015 11:29:38
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bundy5
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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  18:58:20  Show Profile Send bundy5 a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by Legendary Gerry

If you're paying more tax than you have to then that's entirely your fault.

By changing the GST and scrapping some of the other taxes, isn't that a fairer way of getting income for the government?
If you only spend a little you only pay a little; if you spend a lot you pay a lot! Much fairer (as REM is on about) in my book.



I was talking more generally and not particularly about myself.

quote:
Originally posted by CP

quote:
Originally posted by bundy5
I don't see any disasters there in terms of government incompetence. At least not compared to the Rudd/Gillard years.



You are either delusional or a fully paid up Liberal member. The former, I can't help you with, but the latter, I suggest you get a refund as it isn't money well spent.

Where do we start?

Free trade deals with our best buddies in Asia, which while it could be a good thing for farmers and miners, gives an already harder ****ing up the arse of whatever little manufacturing sector we have left.


I'm not sold on it either but the damage to manufacturing is irreparable IMO. Our only real saviour is purely innovation.

quote:
Originally posted by CP



Potential loosening of 457 Visas. Yes, I know someone will say that there are Aussies that don't want to work (it's only a minority that don't want to work though) and they are needed, whilst that is true (most of our best doctors come from Overseas), they are fine and fill that much needed void for skilled employment and that is fine. However, some of the lower skilled jobs offer and employ 457 Visa holders. Take hospitality as an example. A very competitive industry that young Australians aspire to get into, yet can't find employment as 475s are preferred. And Abbott wants to loosen the restrictions on that Visa for low skilled employment?


I don't think there should be a blanket ban on 457 Visa under the proviso that they should be filled by Aussies. There are some positions that we need to recruit people from overseas with the requisite skills to fill.


To respond to Bruce in the NRL thread: it is probably the single hardest loss I have had to deal with at Souths to lose Bully. Much worse than Sam Burgess as he didn't symbolise Souths as Bully did. I think a lot will underestimate just how much a loss he will be to Souths but I fully understand how engrossed he is with NZ and I think given that he will make the successful transition that others haven't.

Edited by - bundy5 on 14 Feb 2015 19:06:05
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CP
Safety Car Pilot



Australia
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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  19:28:15  Show Profile  Visit CP's Homepage Send CP a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by bundy5

quote:
Originally posted by CP



Potential loosening of 457 Visas. Yes, I know someone will say that there are Aussies that don't want to work (it's only a minority that don't want to work though) and they are needed, whilst that is true (most of our best doctors come from Overseas), they are fine and fill that much needed void for skilled employment and that is fine. However, some of the lower skilled jobs offer and employ 457 Visa holders. Take hospitality as an example. A very competitive industry that young Australians aspire to get into, yet can't find employment as 475s are preferred. And Abbott wants to loosen the restrictions on that Visa for low skilled employment?


I don't think there should be a blanket ban on 457 Visa under the proviso that they should be filled by Aussies. There are some positions that we need to recruit people from overseas with the requisite skills to fill.





If you read all of that paragraph, you will see that I agree with 457s for higher skilled jobs. I am not proposing a blanket ban for all 457s, I am just proposing a ban on 457s for low skilled work, such as the example that I mentioned.
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bundy5
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Posted - 14 Feb 2015 :  19:29:43  Show Profile Send bundy5 a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by CP

quote:
Originally posted by bundy5

quote:
Originally posted by CP



Potential loosening of 457 Visas. Yes, I know someone will say that there are Aussies that don't want to work (it's only a minority that don't want to work though) and they are needed, whilst that is true (most of our best doctors come from Overseas), they are fine and fill that much needed void for skilled employment and that is fine. However, some of the lower skilled jobs offer and employ 457 Visa holders. Take hospitality as an example. A very competitive industry that young Australians aspire to get into, yet can't find employment as 475s are preferred. And Abbott wants to loosen the restrictions on that Visa for low skilled employment?


I don't think there should be a blanket ban on 457 Visa under the proviso that they should be filled by Aussies. There are some positions that we need to recruit people from overseas with the requisite skills to fill.





If you read all of that paragraph, you will see that I agree with 457s for higher skilled jobs. I am not proposing a blanket ban for all 457s, I am just proposing a ban on 457s for low skilled work, such as the example that I mentioned.



Well that is different to what they said when they were in opposition.

To respond to Bruce in the NRL thread: it is probably the single hardest loss I have had to deal with at Souths to lose Bully. Much worse than Sam Burgess as he didn't symbolise Souths as Bully did. I think a lot will underestimate just how much a loss he will be to Souths but I fully understand how engrossed he is with NZ and I think given that he will make the successful transition that others haven't.
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bigem
A polar bear



Australia
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Posted - 15 Feb 2015 :  08:30:21  Show Profile Send bigem a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
No reprisals hey Tony?

You even lie to your own kind you dishonest stupid POS!!

In the last 4 days Abbott, Hockey and Pyne have all made statement in the media to the Australian people and all have been caught out fudging figures or doing the opposite to what they said.

And some of you actually believe what these 3 constantly tell us about the economy and how bad it is supposed to be, viewpoints disputed by leading economists and the RBA itself!!

Blind faith?


New Commodore Hey! So you used your own money? Would you like to buy a used bridge?
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CP
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Posted - 15 Feb 2015 :  08:35:51  Show Profile  Visit CP's Homepage Send CP a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by bundy5

Well that is different to what they said when they were in opposition.



What exactly did they say?
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bundy5
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Posted - 15 Feb 2015 :  08:42:43  Show Profile Send bundy5 a Private Message  Reply with Quote Copy this URL to Link to this Reply
quote:
Originally posted by CP

quote:
Originally posted by bundy5

Well that is different to what they said when they were in opposition.



What exactly did they say?



Around about what I said IIRC.

To respond to Bruce in the NRL thread: it is probably the single hardest loss I have had to deal with at Souths to lose Bully. Much worse than Sam Burgess as he didn't symbolise Souths as Bully did. I think a lot will underestimate just how much a loss he will be to Souths but I fully understand how engrossed he is with NZ and I think given that he will make the successful transition that others haven't.
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