ALP v LP/NP

[stevo qld]

Waiting for a mea culpa from people who posted here before the election that Morrison should remain PM.
I'll move on after that.

Already an apologist 3 posts up.  Basically we should be turning a blind eye to blatant corruption and "move on".  What horse ****.

I, for one, advocated a Labor Victory, before and during the election, so I am happy that Morrison is no longer PM.

But, "Corruption"? To me Corruption indicates something illegal and I have yet to see any qualified person brand the actions as illegal.

Perhaps you can provide a reference.

[Trevor]

It is definitely on the nose - he can't even get his story straight, he did it bacuase he could, a grab for ultimate power, another Vladimir Putin in the making. 

He did it because of the lack of confidence in his team

Interesting what Joyce said on Sunday, sounds like he might have known about some of it, but get his mouth shut as he didn't the Nats didn't want to lose more portfolios in retaliation

I can't believe how thick skined he is, even his own party has turned on him, yet there he sits

[REM]

It is definitely on the nose - he can't even get his story straight, he did it bacuase he could, a grab for ultimate power, another Vladimir Putin in the making. 

He did it because of the lack of confidence in his team

Interesting what Joyce said on Sunday, sounds like he might have known about some of it, but get his mouth shut as he didn't the Nats didn't want to lose more portfolios in retaliation

I can't believe how thick skined he is, even his own party has turned on him, yet there he sits

People called him Trump lite- right from the start....the comparison remains a chilling one...but at least ScoMo is toast now....

[Trevor]

We are making news in other parts of the Commonwealth over the Morrison sage, and now the Canadians are asking 'could the same thing happen there'? - and the answer is a big possible yes

Interestingly, the author of that piece says that whilst say Morrison said he only only did this power grab for the pandemic, it appears he actually put things in motion prior to the pandemic to allow this to happen.  Was this reported by Aussie media?

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/colby-cosh-constitutional-shenanigans-down-under-should-have-canadians-worried/ar-AA11bGA0?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=13c4b3b8e1a778f2a9fe1ef1f4ea5139

[Trevor]

Well us Victorians are off to the polls for a State election on November 26

Many many during the pandemic said the current Labor Government would be booted resoundingly, well if the polls are to be believed they will be returned

https://www.roymorgan.com/findings/9038-roy-morgan-survey-on-voting-intention-and-approvals-victoria-august-2022-202208131202

https://crowdwisdom.live/politics/victorian-state-election-opinion-polls/

https://www.pollbludger.net/2022/08/25/victorian-election-minus-three-months/

[madbugger]

Well us Victorians are off to the polls for a State election on November 26

Many many during the pandemic said the current Labor Government would be booted resoundingly, well if the polls are to be believed they will be returned

https://www.roymorgan.com/findings/9038-roy-morgan-survey-on-voting-intention-and-approvals-victoria-august-2022-202208131202

https://crowdwisdom.live/politics/victorian-state-election-opinion-polls/

https://www.pollbludger.net/2022/08/25/victorian-election-minus-three-months/

If the opposition had a half way decent leader/policies etc they would be a shoo in, unfortunately that is not the case.

I think the Morrison secret cabinet positions saga has also put brand Liberal so far on the nose that any chance the Vic Libs had has been affected to the point that they are almost un electable.

[Sonic]

Well us Victorians are off to the polls for a State election on November 26

Many many during the pandemic said the current Labor Government would be booted resoundingly, well if the polls are to be believed they will be returned

https://www.roymorgan.com/findings/9038-roy-morgan-survey-on-voting-intention-and-approvals-victoria-august-2022-202208131202

https://crowdwisdom.live/politics/victorian-state-election-opinion-polls/

https://www.pollbludger.net/2022/08/25/victorian-election-minus-three-months/

If the opposition had a half way decent leader/policies etc they would be a shoo in, unfortunately that is not the case.

I think the Morrison secret cabinet positions saga has also put brand Liberal so far on the nose that any chance the Vic Libs had has been affected to the point that they are almost un electable.

And that is the issue isn't it.

Vic Lab is on the nose, Aus Lib is on the nose....

So let's go against them both and vote independant.. except that an independant will never get to power so you are still voting for Lib/Lab, you just don't get the choice of which one you are voting in.

The idea of the independant is a good one, but it screws up the entire running of the show unfortunately and puts all Australians in a worse place.

[madbugger]

Well us Victorians are off to the polls for a State election on November 26

Many many during the pandemic said the current Labor Government would be booted resoundingly, well if the polls are to be believed they will be returned

https://www.roymorgan.com/findings/9038-roy-morgan-survey-on-voting-intention-and-approvals-victoria-august-2022-202208131202

https://crowdwisdom.live/politics/victorian-state-election-opinion-polls/

https://www.pollbludger.net/2022/08/25/victorian-election-minus-three-months/

If the opposition had a half way decent leader/policies etc they would be a shoo in, unfortunately that is not the case.

I think the Morrison secret cabinet positions saga has also put brand Liberal so far on the nose that any chance the Vic Libs had has been affected to the point that they are almost un electable.

And that is the issue isn't it.

Vic Lab is on the nose, Aus Lib is on the nose....

So let's go against them both and vote independant.. except that an independant will never get to power so you are still voting for Lib/Lab, you just don't get the choice of which one you are voting in.

The idea of the independant is a good one, but it screws up the entire running of the show unfortunately and puts all Australians in a worse place.

Yep, the independants / minor parties can promise what they like, they will never be in a position that they have to deliver it

[Sonic]

Well us Victorians are off to the polls for a State election on November 26

Many many during the pandemic said the current Labor Government would be booted resoundingly, well if the polls are to be believed they will be returned

https://www.roymorgan.com/findings/9038-roy-morgan-survey-on-voting-intention-and-approvals-victoria-august-2022-202208131202

https://crowdwisdom.live/politics/victorian-state-election-opinion-polls/

https://www.pollbludger.net/2022/08/25/victorian-election-minus-three-months/

If the opposition had a half way decent leader/policies etc they would be a shoo in, unfortunately that is not the case.

I think the Morrison secret cabinet positions saga has also put brand Liberal so far on the nose that any chance the Vic Libs had has been affected to the point that they are almost un electable.

And that is the issue isn't it.

Vic Lab is on the nose, Aus Lib is on the nose....

So let's go against them both and vote independant.. except that an independant will never get to power so you are still voting for Lib/Lab, you just don't get the choice of which one you are voting in.

The idea of the independant is a good one, but it screws up the entire running of the show unfortunately and puts all Australians in a worse place.

Yep, the independants / minor parties can promise what they like, they will never be in a position that they have to deliver it

Worse than that. They can hold the whole country to ransom.

I get elected and promise to build a 100 million dollar project.

Joe Bloggs gets elected on 20 votes and holds my project to ransom til he gets his 5 million dollar sideshow.

Jane Bloggs gets elected on 50 votes and does the same.

I now have 90 million to deliver a 100 million dollar project which can't be done without cutting corners or simply not building part of what was promised.

Thanks independants!

[Trevor]

So let's go against them both and vote independant.. except that an independant will never get to power so you are still voting for Lib/Lab, you just don't get the choice of which one you are voting in.

The idea of the independant is a good one, but it screws up the entire running of the show unfortunately and puts all Australians in a worse place.

We have a very effective Independent here, she had 2 good Right candidates running against her this year

]

[Sonic]

So let's go against them both and vote independant.. except that an independant will never get to power so you are still voting for Lib/Lab, you just don't get the choice of which one you are voting in.

The idea of the independant is a good one, but it screws up the entire running of the show unfortunately and puts all Australians in a worse place.

We have a very effective Independent here, she had 2 good Right candidates running against her this year

]

not suggesting that they aren't 'good' Trev, just that they are not what the majority of ALL Australians are voting for.

she may do a fantastic job in looking after her local community but if that is at the expense of the rest of the country then to me that is no different to a state gov looking after the city and ignoring the country...

I know how I think will never happen but it doesn't mean I have to like living in the alternative

[Zac]

Why would being an Independent be at the expense of the rest of the country? Any MP of any persuasion should be doing their best for their electorate while making decisions and voting for what they believe is best for the country. All Independents are there because the majority of voters in their electorates put them there. Representative democracy being the form of government we have here, where the people decide who best represents them. We've decided that the big parties are no longer what we want right now, which is why we now have 10 Independents in the Federal Parliament. Democracy would probably work better with a few more.

[madbugger]

Zac, not sure if you're old enough to remember an independent Senator Brian Harradine in Tasmania. First elected in 1975 and retired before 2004 election. At one point he held the balance of power and held the whole country to ransom. His electorate received funding far disproportionately to any other electorate in memory.

Didn't give a 💩 for the rest of Australia, just his electorate. Of course, he was absolutely loved there, people were almost walking on streets paved with gold.

That is why I will never vote for an independent. IMO they are far more dangerous than either the Libs or Labor desperately trying to cling onto power by whatever means they can.

[Zac]

Zac, not sure if you're old enough to remember an independent Senator Brian Harradine in Tasmania.

You're very kind, but I do remember Brian Harradine. (I don't remember Ben Chifley, but I know that he was Prime Minister when I was born.)

I thought someone would bring up Brian Harradine, but for any examples people may find of independent MPs or Senators abusing their position, I can list more who didn't - and don't. I can also make a far bigger list of MPs and Senators in major parties who abused their position. Your example of that one Senator shows why I said that our democracy would probably work better with more independents.

EDIT to add: I'll give you a better example of an independent MP. This one is a hero of mine, and was an independent in local politics, state politics and federal as well. Have a read...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Mack_(politician)

[stevo qld]

I had a little chuckle watching the news tonight.

Chris Bowen went off script in Parliament.

A significant feature of statements from the ALP is to repeatedly blame the Coalition, over almost nine years, for all the nation's problems.

Chris Bowen, however, was critical of the last TEN years.

That is all of the recent Coalition government, plus ALL of the second Rudd government, plus a chunk of the Gillard government.

Arguably, he is so right.